Hello,
I am looking to build a Lowrider 3, and have printed most of the parts. I wondered if there are any publicly known details on the Lowrider 4. I am trying to decide if it’s better to pull the trigger on the hardware kit now and finish the build before I go back to school or sit on it.
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Hey there, the shop says this:
If it’s not totally urgent, I’d wait it out. 
The hardware kits are going to be nearly the same as far as it looks. So if you printed everything already you could just build the LR3 as well. Do you have the rails yet? If not, you might want to wait… Yeahyeah, I know I am rambling, but it’s not an easy decision.
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This is a mixed bag.
Every indication is that the LR4 will be a significant improvement.
The beta cycle could take weeks or at an outside it could be months.
The LR3 is a great machine.
If you can wait it out, then it’s worth the wait for the LR4.
If you want to get going right away, the LR3 is still a great choice of a machine, and you’ll learn a lot of valuable build and use skills from building it.
Most of the LR3 hardware kit would still apply if you want to upgrade an LR3 to a LR4, but you would need all new printed parts and different sized EMT conduit or metal tube depending on where you are in the world.
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I would like to know, using the same working space will the LR4 fit in the same footprint as the LR3?
As of the current state of the beta, yes. In fact, you will likely gain just a bit of usable cutting area with the LR4 in the same footprint.
All subject to change as the beta evolves.
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Thank you.
So you are saying if I build a table to house an LR3 that the LR4 will fit on it and give a little extra cutting space to boot and most of the parts are going to work in either setup but the printed parts are different? The controller, bearings, belts, pulleys, idlers, and bolts will transfer, but the tubing is a different size.
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At the moment, true. The printed parts are all different. The tubing is a different (larger) diameter.
The LR3 parts kit (minus the printed parts) is a not-perfect, but nearly complete set of materials as there are only minor hardware count changes amongst screws and the like.
It remains to be seen all the details, but the initial results seem very encouraging about the new design.
There will likely be some parts that require machined plates (not that different from how the V5 printer improved from the V4 printer with the addition of metal plates in a few key locations.)
I dare say that the average user will be very pleased with the upgrades.
LR3s will still be great machines and no one should feel like they have to upgrade- but I bet many users will want to upgrade over time.
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Just going to leave this here. Since Ryan put it in the gallery lol
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My advice, is to finish building the LR3, or build the LR3 if you have a 3D printer (printing the parts yourself).
If the LR4 comes out fast you can use it to make some parts for the LR4 and make life a lot easier, cheaper. You will get to learn some things and nearly everything gets used again from the hardware kit. The upgrade is a modest one. On top of that you can abuse the heck out of a new machine learning things, both in use and in assembly. Don’t wait to learn all the skills transfer over.
If the LR4 takes a while to come out then you will be a pro by the time it does. All the rest holds true.
Just yesterday evening, a 4mm change in CAD made a vast majority of the parts change. That is with only one fully built LR4 in the wild. It can get worse or we happen to catch everything on the second try.
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Heck yeah! Finish your LR3 and let’s see those printed parts!
Even when the LR4 comes out many people will stick with their existing LR3 because it’s a great machine. Not every person needs to upgrade to the latest every time.
Don’t get caught in the trap of waiting for the next one. There will always be another one.
I love my LR3 and have learned a bunch.
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Because Ryan is a perfectionist. 
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If somebody asked me about my 3 biggest wishes for the new machine:
- a way to ensure that the gantry will never jump off the Y rail if things go wrong;
- a larger diameter dust shoe + hose;
- an (optional) 2nd X motor to make the X axis as powerful as the Y;
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Would you rather the machine jump or something break? With that said, hearing this complaint is a first. Although I did make the Y connection considerably more robust. I still would rather mistakes be fairly benign than get 3mm/s faster cutting.
I have never once seen a Y axis jump off. The LR2 had an even weaker table to machine connection and at that point the only issue was if built wrong they would drive in an arc.
You can already go to a 4"+ hose what size do you need?
The LR4 those are both optional and easily changed.
Again, the Y has two steppers to hold it in line, it is not about power. The machines are shipped with Conservative current settings. You can easily turn up the steppers 20% is you are having issues and even higher depending on your ambient temps. The machine is pretty over powered at the moment, The LR3 is lacking rigidity way before stepper power.
With that said, the LR4 can be printed in other materials so you can turn the steppers up even higher.
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The mass / inertia of the Y axis is substantially higher than X, where the stepper only has to move the core. If X is losing steps then something is wrong with @karolis’ machine, and should open a troubleshooting topic to work that.
What really defines what an LR3 (or LR4) can do is the router/spindle/cutter, not the rest of the machine.
Once the machine is limited by the cutter, it gets really expensive to step up because you need a more capable tool system, and then you need an entirely different machine design.
The brilliance of the lowrider is that it optimizes capability, cost, and being easily buildable with locally sourcable materials. It’s a careful balancing act and a very difficult design space that Ryan is operating within. Doing a great job of that, in my opinion.
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My main concern is that if something goes wrong, I would like to contain the mess within the area of the table so to say 
I had the gantry jump off the rail a couple of times (don’t remember why exactly, probably one of the Y motors skipped for some reason) and things got pretty ugly pretty fast with the router spinning at full speed and the gantry travelling random directions. That’s the main reason I never leave the machine unattended, even if I have to babysit it 40 minutes straight, which can get pretty boring.
Since I’m cutting foam and I need to remove large volumes of material fast, I am probably pushing the machine much more closer to its limits. When doing 20mm depth roughing cut with a 25mm burr I really don’t care about accuracy much, I just want to remove the material fast. And the X axis always skips first if I go too deep or too fast. Now I have to design my roughing passes to mostly use Y axis movement in order to save time and have less chances of skipped steps. Dual X motors would help, but again my scenario is probably not the most typical use of LR3.
Seriously, first time I have ever heard of it coming off a track. That had to just be bad CAM.
And yes ,never ever, ever leave it alone, it will burn your house down in minutes. This is not design to take your eyes off of.
If you are moving fast you will gain 20% more power by switching to a 20T pulley for a couple bucks. This was designed for hared material, that cuts much slower.
Don’t suffer in silence, if you are having issues let us know so we can give you tips like that. 20% more power at a higher speed by just changing three pulleys. Simple fix.
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Plus at least 20% more current to add to the stepper in the config, possibly more if you monitor stepper temps or add stepper heat sinks.
Yes, get community support!
+1
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I think it can also happen because of a simple human mistake, such as leaving some tool on the table that obstructs movement of the Y axis. If one side of the Y axis is blocked and the other keeps moving, there is a good chance the gantry will pop off the rail. I am also moving it a bit faster than normal (some passes go at 25cm/sec), which adds more inertia to the equation as well.
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I wouldn’t call it suffering at all! Overall, I love the LR3! I think it’s a great machine for the price. Since you were working on a new version, I just decided to give my input of my most wanted features, that’s all.
Regarding speed improvements, I already did a few things:
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Upgraded to 24V PSU (would consider going higher, but the TMC drivers seem to be 28V max)
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Increased the motor current in the firmware. I think my current setting is 900, the motors are still coldish but the driver heat sinks are super hot. To increase the current even more, I would need to add some proper ventilation for the the drivers.
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I bought 20T pulleys even before I assembled the machine for the first time. Then I used the standard pulleys just in case I want to mill some plywood, which turned out to be very useful in the long run.
Overall, adding another X motor seemed like a cheap and reasonable solution to double the power of the “weakest” axis of the machine, so I just mentioned it here in case you find the idea interesting )
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