As many do, I’ve been lurking here for a while researching. Have got my spreadsheet of links and prices nearly complete with everything I need to order to build my MPCNC Primo.
Then I spotted the recently released FoxAlien Masuter Pro on Amazon and started to doubt. I enjoy building and learning, but on the other hand I’m always short on time and the idea of taking something out of the box and being able to cut within a few hours has some appeal.
It was under $600 a couple of days ago (and I assume would be again sometime soon). I was planning to go with a SKR Pro CB (with display) and stainless tubes so the MPCNC would cost almost the same.
I would of course plan to replace the stock spindle with a Makita or similar (which it includes a tool mount for in the box). Belts for XY, lead screw for Z same as the MPCNC (although 6mm belts). I expect the steppers are probably weak compared to what I’d put on a MPCNC. How would this compare in rigidity and accuracy to a MPCNC? I’m not planning to cut anything too exotic - primarily carbon fiber sheet (racing quad frame parts) and wood (plywood, softwood, MDF). Possibly some acrylic. For the wood, I expect +/- 1mm would be good enough for most things I would do. However for the drone frames more like +/- 0.1mm or better would be needed otherwise parts won’t fit properly or press nuts will fall out. I was planning to keep the MPCNC work area to around 450mm x 350mm so there is minimal tube flex.
Convince me why a MPCNC is the better option and that the work to build it will be worth it.
If you need to be convinced that going through the pain exercise of printing, building, calibrating, and maintaining your own machine is worth it, my guess is that it isn’t. For you. For someone else, they may want it to tinker with. Maybe they want to get a better, or deeper, understanding of how CNCs work. But if your time is super valuable to you, and you don’t want the hands-on experience, then a MPCNC is likely not for you.
Just by eyeball, their design looks pretty good. Nothing is screaming at me that says they made a bad choice anywhere. At least, not for the model shown.
You say nothing exotic, but then lead with CF sheet… Most setups I’ve seen cut that under water, given how horrifically nasty the dust is. (I think the big shops actually use water jet cutters for CF, but those are really only viable at a scale far beyond anyone working out of their garage.) Just something to think about…
But it’s 4AM, and I’m rambling. So take everything I said with a hefty grain of salt, as I am likely either factually wrong, or suffering from fatigue-related dementia. Possibly both.
Oh, and welcome to the funhouse! Regardless of what rig you get, feel free to hang out and talk shop, ask questions, show off the things you make, and/or generally talk smack about the zeros that got away…
Cheers for the welcome.
Yes I’m aware cutting carbon needs some precautions. I’m thinking dust boot venting outside plus enclosure to catch what escapes, or cutting in a water bath. If I go water bath I need to consider z height and how to clamp inside the bath. Inevitably grubby water will get splashed around which makes the MPCNC design look better with everything up off the deck.
Where the MPCNC is going to shine is flexibility in terms of things such as size, firmware, additions, etc. If the Masuter Pro meets your needs for the foreseeable future, then it seems like a good solution. My one concern is firmware. Hopefully they have something pretty generic on the board so that postprocessors are easy to find. I did see on a quick search that they were trying to upsell Easel Pro for this machine, so it is possible there is something proprietary in the firmware.
I’m not going to guess on their rigidity or anything. Honestly just having a cnc machine is a big step over not having one. So it doesn’t really matter on an entry level machine.
I don’t really like this call to action. You may not believe it, but I prefer you get the machine that works best for you. If my words convince you to get an MPCNC and that was the wrong choice for you, then I will feel worse.
I think most people feel the same. Even Ryan isn’t making enough money on one kit to compromise his morals.
Some things I would point out though:
Even if it is not a kit like the MPCNC, it does require a lot of effort to learn to run any cnc machine. They are not inkjet printers. Ve prepared to turn your brain into a sponge and waste a lot of materials while you are learning.
The work space is only 16"x16"x2". That isn’t necessarily a bad thing. But it is smaller than most mpcncs.
If something breaks, or bends, or snaps, can you fix it? If you wanted to swap to 10mm belts, can you do that? The MPCNC is completely flexible and if you look through the builds section, you will see a lot of mods.
The best argument for an MPCNC is the gallery-mpcnc. But please, get the machine that is right for you. The V1 machines do require learning. They do require some work to build and tune.
I love these answers. I think it really shows the integrity of the people hanging out in this forum.
I’d consider myself entering the “toddler” phase with my MPCNC. I’ve started cutting wood with some success. So, I might be comparable to you in a month or two.
v1pi - This addition is invaluable to me. I don’t want to have my computer near the machine when I’m throwing dust. Certainly not if I’m trying to use water to catch the dust.
Size - I built the most basic machine with a 6" longer X. Your upgrade to the stainless tubes is a great idea, as you’ll likely be able to cut faster than I can. The small size of that FoxAlien unit may be a benefit for quad parts.
Mods/Changes - I’m only a few weeks in and I keep a list of mods I want to make to the machine. I’m not sure how easy mods would be to that FoxAlien machine, but I’d bet the community here beats theirs.
I understand that in deciding to get a CNC I’m embarking on a journey. However when I posted last night I was thinking that by buying a ready made one I’d be immediately arriving at the destination. I take your point that this is unlikely to be the case, and that a good deal of work will be required to learn how to operate one. And that that the learning process might actually be easier on a machine I have put together myself, and am able to mod as required.
Welcome…
Usually these have a slightly upgraded GRBL controller on the low end cost break, like a 3018 (I have one). The spindle appears to be the 770 watt upgrade motor from the 3018 world.
I used the 3018 to get my feet wet in CNC. A 3018 is a cheap, around $200, you can usually find a package with a set of bits, er11 collets, and a offline controller pendant.
I still use my 3018 for some stuff. I have 2 MPCNC’s of different sizes, with the parts printed for a third, that will be highly modified for a CNC lathe.
The advantages to the MPCNC, or Lowrider3, is scalability, a very active support from the inventor (Ryan), Jeff above, and lots of community help.
If you come from a 3d printing world to CNC, the MPCNC is a lower learning curve as well.
On rigidity, I used 1 inch DOM tubing with a .120" wall. My two are way above recommended size, and using this >0.0002 flex on a 26-46" width.
My Opinion is that you’ll probably be better off with the machine that comes out of the box. Further, I think that given your list of target materials, you may be better off spending more money on something that will be ultimately more capable.
The MPCNC is really good at what it does, but I have limited expectations of what it will do for pretty much anything that isn’t wood, and that I’ll have a lot of learning to do if I want to change materials. I’ve done a bit in acrylic, and it was a pretty big mess, so I know I’ve got a lot to learn there. I won’t touch CF plate. I hope to be able to do aluminum at some point. So far, the MPCNC has met and exceeded my expectations, so for me it was a great decision, given that I also love to tinker.
Most of the more expensive machines work MUCH faster, and have a wider range of speeds, can cut deeper, into more varieties of material. It seems to me that you’re likely to be happier with a higher end machine than either the MPCNC or the FoxAlien, but that’s just my impression.
That pretty much tells me you already get where I was going to come from on your choice. If you have some orders for cf parts you need to fill yesterday, maybe foxeer… if you want to become a ‘cnc guru’ and the orders can wait, maybe mpcnc.
Cutting CF at 0.1mm (4 thou) is doable on mpcnc. However if that’s a big priority, I’d definitely minimize the work area as much as possible, especially the z since it affects xy flex and you don’t need height for sheets.
@Heatsink I built my MPCNC in March and honestly, I enjoyed the build and what I had learned so far, however a couple of week ago, my machine was not working right and I had to practically put everything apart and put them back together and during this time I came across this same machine and I was almost taking the plunge. I didn’t, but figured out what was wrong with my MPCNC and is working again. If you do not like figuring out “what’s wrong” or you do not have time like you said, I’ll say take the plunge and get the FoxAlien.
From an entry point of view, it’ll probably be easier to go with one that is built already… And yes there is a but… And here it comes.
When you take the time to build and calibrate, and something ultimately goes wrong, you will generally know how to fix it.
Ask anybody here that has built an Mpcnc if they are done building it. Chances are they’ll say no as there is always something you can customize and make it better for you. Just when I finish with one upgrade, I’m thinking of something else to do. The firmware is so customizable and once you tinker with it enough, you can really make it personal to you. Machines that are made already generally don’t have that level of flexibility.
If all you want is a machine to do work, just like a 3d printer, you should just buy one. But if you’re looking for something that can grow with your level of experience, you should build one.
Because of what the Mpcnc experience gave me, I’ve since then designed and built my own laser engraver with probe sensors and the works.
Building the MPCNC gave me a reason to buy new tools and 3D printer, so it was a 2 in 1 deal for me.
I have a pretty extensive build thread with a lot of modifications over the time, feel free to check it out. I am pretty sure I would not have been happy with an out of the box solution.
True. This is exactly what I tell people interested in drone racing. Most racers build their own quads so that you know how to fix it when they break it.
I’ve decided to stick with my plan of building a machine and gave started ordering parts. Cheers.
@Heatsink Glad you made a choice as to what you were going to do and good luck with your build.
I waned to add for those other newbies that come across this post in their research for CNC machines:
This still rings true with a prebuilt system you get right out of the box. Most CNCs still have “some assembly required” and will still need to be tuned and calibrated. YES, the assembly part is much easier as it is just “insert Tab A into Slot B and use machine screw from package 1,” and it will still just “work” out of the box, but for it to be worth anything, you will still need to calibrate and tune it. Just like any 3D printer.
